# Leg pains? **URL:** \ **Category:** Fixed Street\ **Created:** [February 6, 2009, 2:03am UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443 "2009-02-06T02:03:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![AL9000](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/al9000/32/7_2.png) [@AL9000](https://fixed.org.au/u/AL9000)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 3:05pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/21 "2009-02-09T15:05:38Z")
> [@antmandan](#): > > Well thought out, referenced, coherent argument I like your style. ---
**Author:** ![brendan](https://fixed.org.au/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@brendan](https://fixed.org.au/u/brendan)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 3:10pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/22 "2009-02-09T15:10:16Z")
> [@lewis](#): > > > [@brendan](#): > > > > > [@shortsie](#): > > > > > > i love soy milk > > me too! > > hey brendan, i met you in sydney yeah? yep, i reckon so. you were the guy who rode out with us monday morning and had a sweet ABC Weapons patch, right? ---
**Author:** ![Bender](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/bender/32/111_2.png) [@Bender](https://fixed.org.au/u/Bender)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 3:12pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/23 "2009-02-09T15:12:40Z")
Don’t fuck with Dan the man will eat you alive with the knowledge that is stored in that head of his 😃 ---
**Author:** ![shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/shortsie/32/89_2.png) [@shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/u/shortsie)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 3:13pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/24 "2009-02-09T15:13:41Z")
> [@SanEsteban](#): > > Hey guys, I hate to rain on your parade but soy milk is high in phyto-oestrogens, which not only accelerate the growth of cancerous tumours, but being similar to the fundamental female hormone, is also great for your man boobies and sperm count. ![](http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/9935/pwned3b4627fej9.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Donga](https://fixed.org.au/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/c0e974/32.png) [@Donga](https://fixed.org.au/u/Donga)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:22pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/25 "2009-02-09T16:22:52Z")
> [@Sime](#): > > Took the fixed out for a spin to see if i could loosen it up but it made zero difference and didnt seem to hurt to much while spinning. Riding fixed is not going to loosen up your achilles - quite the reverse in my experience. In order to keep riding fixed, I had to go on a 12-week program of exercises to loosen up and regain flexibility - and now do them every time I ride a fixed bike. ---
**Author:** ![SanEsteban](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/sanesteban/32/136_2.png) [@SanEsteban](https://fixed.org.au/u/SanEsteban)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:25pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/26 "2009-02-09T16:25:10Z")
> [@antmandan](#): > > No let’s get back to talking about bike stuff, not crappy hack pseudo-science that some dick has pulled from the Herald Sun. Just like any debate in science there are arguments for and against. Quoting journal articles can get you in trouble if you present a biased viewpoint. It’s not thorough. I’ll give you an example: I said nothing about soy products having the highest phytoestrogen content. However, you should read article 2 again, because even the abstract states that the soy protein isolate “significantly decreased” testosterone levels. You imply that many falsely “jump to a conclusion that there is a correlation between soybean ingestion and lower testosterone” yet you then spout this as evidence that that soy product may protect against the development of prostate cancer. Many epidemiological studies have been conducted to determine the relationship between phytoestrogen intake and the risk of various diseases, particularly breast and prostate cancer, with conflicting results [1-19]. However, most studies showed no relationship, even to lax confidence intervals. Furthermore, diets high in soy isoflavines have been attributed with impaired male fertility [20, 21]. But I get my information on such matters from my girlfriend who has a masters in genetics, and is doing her Ph.D in this area at the Westmead Millennium Institute (Westmead Institute for Cancer Research). While the jury is out, I’m sticking to cows milk. If you’re wrong, and your balls fall off and you grow man boobies, give me a call; we could go out sometime. Now, lets take a chill pill and learn to take life a little less seriously, and that when a “scientific” comment is made on a cycling forum stating the technical term “man boobies” it is probably made in jest, acknowledging that such claims cannot be taken seriously. 1. Peeters PHM, Keinan-Boker L, van der Schouw YT, and Grobbee DE: Phytoestrogens and breast cancer risk. Breast Cancer Res Treat 77, 171–183, 2003. 2. de Kleijn MJ, van der Schouw YT, Wilson PW, Grobbee DE, and Jacques PF: Dietary intake of phytoestrogens is associated with a favorable metabolic cardiovascular risk profile in postmenopausal U.S. women: the Framingham study. J Nutr 132, 276–282, 2002. 3. Lee HP, Gourley L, Duffy SW, Esteve J, Lee J, et al.: Dietary effects on breast-cancer risk in Singapore. Lancet 337, 1197–1200, 1991. 4. Hirose K, Tajima K, Hamajima N, Inoue M, Takezaki T, et al.: A large-scale, hospital-based case-control study of risk factors of breast cancer according to menopausal status. Jpn J Cancer Res 86, 146–154, 5. 6. Dai Q, Shu XO, Jin F, Potter JD, Kushi LH, et al.: Population-based case-control study of soyfood intake and breast cancer risk in Shanghai. Br J Cancer 85, 372–378, 2001. 7. Yamamoto S, Sobue T, Kobayashi M, Sasaki S, and Tsugane S: Soy, isoflavones, and breast cancer risk in Japan. J Natl Cancer Inst 95, 906–913, 2003. 8. Wu AH, Ziegler RG, Horn-Ross PL, Nomura AM, West DW, et al.: Tofu and risk of breast cancer in Asian-Americans. Cancer Epidemiol Biomarkers Prev 5, 901–906, 1996. 9. Wu AH, Wan P, Hankin J, Tseng CC, Yu MC, et al.: Adolescent and adult soy intake and risk of breast cancer in Asian-Americans. Carcinogenesis 23, 1491–1496, 2002. 10. Wu AH: Phytoestrogens and cancer: epidemiologic evidence. In Phytoestrogens and Health, Gilani GS and Anderson J (eds). Champaign, IL: AOCS Press, 2002, pp 371–404. 11. Key TJ, Sharp GB, Appleby PN, Beral V, Goodman MT, et al.: Soya foods and breast cancer risk: a prospective study in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Japan. Br J Cancer 81, 1248–1256, 1999. 12. Witte JS, Ursin G, Siemiatycki J, Thompson WD, Paganini-Hill A, et al.: Diet and premenopausal bilateral breast cancer: a case-control study. Breast Cancer Res Treat 42, 243–251, 1997. 13. McCann SE, Moysich KB, Freudenheim JL, Ambrosone CB, and Shields PG: The risk of breast cancer associated with dietary lignans differs by CYP17 genotype in women. J Nutr 132, 3036–3041, 2002. 14. McCann SE, Muti P, Vito D, Edge SB, Trevisan M, et al.: Dietary lignan intakes and risk of pre- and postmenopausal breast cancer. Int J Cancer 111, 440–443, 2004. 15. Keinan-Boker L, van Der Schouw YT, Grobbee DE, and Peeters PHM. Dietary phytoestrogens and breast cancer risk. Am J Clin Nutr 79, 282–288, 2004. 16. Horn-Ross PL, John EM, Lee M, Stewart SL, Koo J, et al.: Phytoestrogen consumption and breast cancer risk in a multiethnic population: the Bay Area Breast Cancer Study. Am J Epidemiol 154, 434–441, 2001. 17. Linseisen J, Piller R, Hermann S, and Chang-Claude J: Dietary phytoestrogen intake and premenopausal breast cancer risk in a German case-control study. Int J Cancer 110, 284–290, 2004. 18. Shu XO, Jin F, Dai Q,WenW, Potter JD, et al.: Soyfood intake during adolescence and subsequent risk of breast cancer among Chinese women. Cancer Epidemiol Biomarkers Prev 10, 483–488, 2001. 19. Dirx MJM, van den Brandt PA, Goldbohm RA, and Lumey LH: Diet in adolescence and the risk of breast cancer: results of the Netherlands Cohort Study. Cancer Causes Control 10, 189–199, 1999. 20. Strom SS, Yamamura Y, Duphorne CM, Spitz MR, Babaian RJ, et al.: Phytoestrogen intake and prostate cancer: a case-control study using a new database. Nutr Cancer 33, 20–25, 1999. 21. Effect of a phytoestrogen food supplement on reproductive health in normal males Julie H. MITCHELL\*, Elizabeth CAWOOD†, David KINNIBURGH†, Anne PROVAN\*, Andrew R. COLLINS\* and D. Stewart IRVINE† 22. Reproductive toxicity assessment of chronic dietary exposure to soy isoflavones in male rats Ali S. Faqi, William D. Johnson, Robert L. Morrissey and David L. McCormick ---
**Author:** ![EzyLee](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/ezylee/32/142_2.png) [@EzyLee](https://fixed.org.au/u/EzyLee)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/27 "2009-02-09T16:41:54Z")
Woah, this thread smells of nerd. ---
**Author:** ![Bender](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/bender/32/111_2.png) [@Bender](https://fixed.org.au/u/Bender)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:47pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/28 "2009-02-09T16:47:01Z")
![](http://images.google.com.au/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://www.joeydevilla.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/nerds.jpg&usg=AFQjCNH3oCGbzavJXsa-BQkVaRyLHihzcw) ---
**Author:** ![shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/shortsie/32/89_2.png) [@shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/u/shortsie)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:48pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/29 "2009-02-09T16:48:00Z")
![](http://www.pics.deathsadvocate.com/PWNED%20by%20MJ.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![horatio](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/horatio/32/42_2.png) [@horatio](https://fixed.org.au/u/horatio)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:49pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/30 "2009-02-09T16:49:08Z")
> [@EzyLee](#): > > Woah, this thread smells of nerd. …and estrogen/testosterone mixture… ---
**Author:** ![shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/shortsie/32/89_2.png) [@shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/u/shortsie)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 4:52pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/31 "2009-02-09T16:52:36Z")
> [@hjb1000](#): > > > [@EzyLee](#): > > > > Woah, this thread smells of nerd. > > …testosterone mixture… Synthetic? ---
**Author:** ![heatseeker](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/heatseeker/32/53_2.png) [@heatseeker](https://fixed.org.au/u/heatseeker)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/32 "2009-02-09T17:03:16Z")
I hate Soy milk. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . just sayin. ---
**Author:** ![EzyLee](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/ezylee/32/142_2.png) [@EzyLee](https://fixed.org.au/u/EzyLee)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 5:14pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/33 "2009-02-09T17:14:44Z")
> [@hjb1000](#): > > > [@EzyLee](#): > > > > Woah, this thread smells of nerd. > > …and estrogen/testosterone mixture… …and kinda like a lactose intolerant wet milky fart. ---
**Author:** ![antmandan](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/antmandan/32/115_2.png) [@antmandan](https://fixed.org.au/u/antmandan)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 5:25pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/34 "2009-02-09T17:25:47Z")
Ease up there bro, I was simply refuting your statement: > Hey guys, I hate to rain on your parade but soy milk is high in phyto-oestrogens, which not only accelerate the growth of cancerous tumours, but being similar to the fundamental female hormone, is also great for your man boobies and sperm count. From your statement you advocated that: - Soy milk accelerates the growth of cancerous tumors - Has a `femaling’ effect on men by giving you man boobs and reducing your sperm count. Which you yourself have subsequently backpedalled on as there is no solid evidence to make these claims. On that I think we are in agreement so I’m happy to drop it. As for the comments being made in jest, similar bullshit propaganda flows out there about motorists subsidising cyclists use of the road. Do you think that the average punter thinks that this `information’ is made in jest? Or do they store that soundbite to roll out in an argument when you rock around on your treadly? Sorry but as a bris-vegan I’m sick of this kind of shit continuing to flow around out there which is why I jumped on it. I don’t mean to offend but the public has a pretty poor perception of vegans as a whole due to these myths floating around out there.[/rant] ---
**Author:** ![SanEsteban](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/sanesteban/32/136_2.png) [@SanEsteban](https://fixed.org.au/u/SanEsteban)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 6:00pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/35 "2009-02-09T18:00:38Z")
> [@antmandan](#): > > Soy milk accelerates the growth of cancerous tumors Specifically it does depend on the type of tumour, as there are more than just breast and prostate cancers. But as we are aware, there are arguments for and against. A bris-vegan from bris-vegas. That has a good ring to it. It seems there are some people that believe everything they read; and I admit that I do have a habit of making up shit for (usually my own) entertainment so I will take it easy on the sarcasm from here on out and make sure any jocular comments are made devoid of subtlety by using one of these: 😃 , 😉, “haha”, “LOL”. For example: I wouldn’t jump to the conclusion that there is a causation between soy products and low testosterone however a logical hypothesis would then be that there is a correlation between vegan males and naturally low testosterone. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/shortsie/32/89_2.png) [@shortsie](https://fixed.org.au/u/shortsie)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 6:01pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/36 "2009-02-09T18:01:49Z")
YAWN. ---
**Author:** ![snowflake](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/snowflake/32/3245_2.png) [@snowflake](https://fixed.org.au/u/snowflake)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 6:09pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/37 "2009-02-09T18:09:06Z")
Does it disappoint anybody else that many so-called discussion forums just like this one have become a pissing contest for people posting stupid pictures they found on the internet? Seriously, if all you have to contribute are links to bullshit pictures somewhere on the internet maybe you should get out more or something. ---
**Author:** ![heavymetal](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/heavymetal/32/69_2.png) [@heavymetal](https://fixed.org.au/u/heavymetal)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/38 "2009-02-09T18:22:28Z")
> [@snowflake](#): > > Does it disappoint anybody else not me. ---
**Author:** ![heatseeker](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/heatseeker/32/53_2.png) [@heatseeker](https://fixed.org.au/u/heatseeker)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 6:31pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/39 "2009-02-09T18:31:12Z")
Or me. . (trolling lolcatz for something suitable) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![snowflake](https://fixed.org.au/user_avatar/fixed.org.au/snowflake/32/3245_2.png) [@snowflake](https://fixed.org.au/u/snowflake)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2009, 6:39pm UTC](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443/40 "2009-02-09T18:39:15Z")
> [@heatseeker](#): > > Or me. . > > (trolling lolcatz for something suitable) 😉 OK. Must be me then. I’m sure you’ll find a suitable pic to reply with. [Previous page](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443.md?page=1) [Next page](https://fixed.org.au/t/leg-pains/38443.md?page=3)